Love love love seeing an example of friends stepping up for friends in their time of need! I also love love love learning more about the economic decisions that shape motherhood in the United States. Adding The Price of Motherhood to my reading list! The only thing that doesn't sit well with me is directing this frustration at mothers specifically. *Shouldn't we aim our frustration and rage at policymakers who have the power to legislate change?*
When you asked, "What was she actually asking?" The immediate response that came to my mind was, "Are you economically independent?" Maybe she's silently suffering due to her own loss of economic independence. Hearing how you're able to earn a living while raising young kids might give her a few new ideas about what's possible. The question is clumsy and I've been hurt by it many times, too. But I feel a strong desire to give mothers asking, "Do you work?" more grace and more social support.
Regardless, I appreciate this discussion. It's so important!
Brittany what a beautiful reframe. I WISH and HOPE your read of the intent of these questions is correct. I agree with you that so many of these women are trapped and dependent. I don't know that many are aware of their own dependency and prison (those who are aware have never asked me this question). This question came specifically from women with status and whose power came from proximity to their partner.
In preparing this piece i read up on benevolent sexism and the internalized misogyny so many of us unknowingly carry and pass on to our children and each other. It comes from a legacy of not having safety, and being able to secure it through indirect means (beauty, network, access).
None of the women who asked me this question lacked support (on paper - we can never really know) - that was the odd thing! The question came from high status, high socioeconomic women with families who lived nearby, regular babysitters (many had live in help), house cleaners, active social lives, cooks, and spouses who were rarely home. That was what fascinated me.
Oh, wow. Yes, that socioeconomic eliminate is fascinating and bewildering to me, too. Your hypothesis on using that question to gauge your economic status makes more sense to me now. Thank you for sharing this extra background!
I am suuuuuuuuper interested in exploring internalized misogyny. Starting tuned for more!
I'm a recovering asker of "what do you do for work?" after having lived in New York and been in a lot of business-y circles for so long.
I still remember a mom I met saying, "Oh, I don't work. Well I do, I manage rental properties and run the household for our 3 kids."
It hit me that my original question is incredibly flawed and I liked that she followed up her initial response. Now I don't ask these questions, but it got me thinking a lot more broadly about what it means to "work". This essay really hit the ball out of the park, thanks for sharing it!
Oh my goshhhhh do I relate to the woman who answered like that. INVALIDATION RUNS SO DEEP.
The east coast/west coast thing is so real, too. My west coast friends allege that you are supposed to connect with people asking about their weekend and hobbies. I was like ummmm, "What is this word, "hobbies?" You mean work right?" smh
What do you ask now?!?!
I've been asking, "what is something you're looking forward to/most excited about." It's a great filter for who is a good fit for friendship because some people light up and you learn so much. And others think you're a weirdo (which according to Sarah, I am one of those too but SHE MEANS IT IN A GOOD WAY RIGHT SARAH)
Fellow recovering “what do you do for work” person. but coming from the earlier piece around wanting to have community/find the others that feel trapped in a lower paid and therefore can’t be financially independent and also raise kids at the same time situation.
I’ve started to ask “so what’s bringing you joy these days” as my ice breaker.
What HAS helped is playing the thank you game with my kids every night where we voice to each other what we were grateful for. It means I have a ready list of thing making me happy that I can rattle off to prevent the dreaded awkward silence of this person is a weirdo.
I don't have any great questions to ask, but I love yours. I've been trying to keep it as focused on the present moment, like the weather or whatever thing we're doing now.
I'm not great at small talk, I'd rather dive into the deep stuff so it's a tricky thing for me still. ;)
This was a great, and infuriating read (the societal aspect, not the great writing lol)’. In my geography and circles it’s implied meaning is whether you can afford the expensive houses on only income.
It’s turned into such fun discussion because I’m game to subvert what they’re used to hearing in that our structure isn’t quite traditional.
But it often leads to me spiraling about how much I love work and feel guilty at times that our setup doesn’t allow me to have the stay home option. I know I wouldn’t do well if the tables were turned, but it still unearths some jealousy.
A question I started asking at work, and now elsewhere is: tell me something you have a niche level of knowledge on? It’s fascinating to hear others things that bring joy!!
OOOO this is an AWESOME question. Agree re: fascinating to hear things that bring others joy. I've felt that way since launching Brainstorm Road - it's the first business that's made me ENJOY small talk because I get to talk about the things that light people up.
question: "it’s implied meaning is whether you can afford the expensive houses on only income." What do you mean only on income? Like only on ONE income? or versus family money? And why specifically the expensive houses vs private schools or vacations or cars. So curious about this!!
Thanks for double clicking here, it’s making me dig deeper on several fronts.
To me, these interactions are most often happening at a playground or park, so it’s a couple minute broken conversation between rescuing littles from danger. In that sense - I’m not hearing about private schools and crazy vacations - and I’d be very jealous if so. I assume others also aren’t doing those things bc of the age of kids and feeling strapped financially. Maybe just me 🤣🫣
I always ask questions surrounding work. As a recovering workaholic, it’s an easy topic that I genuinely am curious about. I don’t think about the ways I could be making others feel when I ask that. Although I will absolutely call a mom out for the “I’m just a mom” line. You are so much more. I try to remind them that this is a stage where they are serving their families and soon enough there will be time to devote back to ourselves and we’ll desperately miss these times with our littles. But I’m always game to be a listening ear if they need someone to just listen to why it’s hard too. Complaining helps, right 🤣
Love love love seeing an example of friends stepping up for friends in their time of need! I also love love love learning more about the economic decisions that shape motherhood in the United States. Adding The Price of Motherhood to my reading list! The only thing that doesn't sit well with me is directing this frustration at mothers specifically. *Shouldn't we aim our frustration and rage at policymakers who have the power to legislate change?*
When you asked, "What was she actually asking?" The immediate response that came to my mind was, "Are you economically independent?" Maybe she's silently suffering due to her own loss of economic independence. Hearing how you're able to earn a living while raising young kids might give her a few new ideas about what's possible. The question is clumsy and I've been hurt by it many times, too. But I feel a strong desire to give mothers asking, "Do you work?" more grace and more social support.
Regardless, I appreciate this discussion. It's so important!
Brittany what a beautiful reframe. I WISH and HOPE your read of the intent of these questions is correct. I agree with you that so many of these women are trapped and dependent. I don't know that many are aware of their own dependency and prison (those who are aware have never asked me this question). This question came specifically from women with status and whose power came from proximity to their partner.
In preparing this piece i read up on benevolent sexism and the internalized misogyny so many of us unknowingly carry and pass on to our children and each other. It comes from a legacy of not having safety, and being able to secure it through indirect means (beauty, network, access).
None of the women who asked me this question lacked support (on paper - we can never really know) - that was the odd thing! The question came from high status, high socioeconomic women with families who lived nearby, regular babysitters (many had live in help), house cleaners, active social lives, cooks, and spouses who were rarely home. That was what fascinated me.
Oh, wow. Yes, that socioeconomic eliminate is fascinating and bewildering to me, too. Your hypothesis on using that question to gauge your economic status makes more sense to me now. Thank you for sharing this extra background!
I am suuuuuuuuper interested in exploring internalized misogyny. Starting tuned for more!
I'm a recovering asker of "what do you do for work?" after having lived in New York and been in a lot of business-y circles for so long.
I still remember a mom I met saying, "Oh, I don't work. Well I do, I manage rental properties and run the household for our 3 kids."
It hit me that my original question is incredibly flawed and I liked that she followed up her initial response. Now I don't ask these questions, but it got me thinking a lot more broadly about what it means to "work". This essay really hit the ball out of the park, thanks for sharing it!
Oh my goshhhhh do I relate to the woman who answered like that. INVALIDATION RUNS SO DEEP.
The east coast/west coast thing is so real, too. My west coast friends allege that you are supposed to connect with people asking about their weekend and hobbies. I was like ummmm, "What is this word, "hobbies?" You mean work right?" smh
What do you ask now?!?!
I've been asking, "what is something you're looking forward to/most excited about." It's a great filter for who is a good fit for friendship because some people light up and you learn so much. And others think you're a weirdo (which according to Sarah, I am one of those too but SHE MEANS IT IN A GOOD WAY RIGHT SARAH)
Good weirdo ❤️
Fellow recovering “what do you do for work” person. but coming from the earlier piece around wanting to have community/find the others that feel trapped in a lower paid and therefore can’t be financially independent and also raise kids at the same time situation.
I’ve started to ask “so what’s bringing you joy these days” as my ice breaker.
What HAS helped is playing the thank you game with my kids every night where we voice to each other what we were grateful for. It means I have a ready list of thing making me happy that I can rattle off to prevent the dreaded awkward silence of this person is a weirdo.
P.S. Sarah I’m a good weirdo too🤣
I don't have any great questions to ask, but I love yours. I've been trying to keep it as focused on the present moment, like the weather or whatever thing we're doing now.
I'm not great at small talk, I'd rather dive into the deep stuff so it's a tricky thing for me still. ;)
This was a great, and infuriating read (the societal aspect, not the great writing lol)’. In my geography and circles it’s implied meaning is whether you can afford the expensive houses on only income.
It’s turned into such fun discussion because I’m game to subvert what they’re used to hearing in that our structure isn’t quite traditional.
But it often leads to me spiraling about how much I love work and feel guilty at times that our setup doesn’t allow me to have the stay home option. I know I wouldn’t do well if the tables were turned, but it still unearths some jealousy.
A question I started asking at work, and now elsewhere is: tell me something you have a niche level of knowledge on? It’s fascinating to hear others things that bring joy!!
OOOO this is an AWESOME question. Agree re: fascinating to hear things that bring others joy. I've felt that way since launching Brainstorm Road - it's the first business that's made me ENJOY small talk because I get to talk about the things that light people up.
question: "it’s implied meaning is whether you can afford the expensive houses on only income." What do you mean only on income? Like only on ONE income? or versus family money? And why specifically the expensive houses vs private schools or vacations or cars. So curious about this!!
Thank you for sharing
Typo on my part. Yes one income!
Thanks for double clicking here, it’s making me dig deeper on several fronts.
To me, these interactions are most often happening at a playground or park, so it’s a couple minute broken conversation between rescuing littles from danger. In that sense - I’m not hearing about private schools and crazy vacations - and I’d be very jealous if so. I assume others also aren’t doing those things bc of the age of kids and feeling strapped financially. Maybe just me 🤣🫣
I always ask questions surrounding work. As a recovering workaholic, it’s an easy topic that I genuinely am curious about. I don’t think about the ways I could be making others feel when I ask that. Although I will absolutely call a mom out for the “I’m just a mom” line. You are so much more. I try to remind them that this is a stage where they are serving their families and soon enough there will be time to devote back to ourselves and we’ll desperately miss these times with our littles. But I’m always game to be a listening ear if they need someone to just listen to why it’s hard too. Complaining helps, right 🤣
Ok, don’t think that answered what you asked. 🙃